Known for his riff-driven anthems with Rage Against the Machine and Audioslave, his out of the box guitar solos, and his anti-establishment political activism, Tom Morello is talking with us today for reasons beyond all of that. For now, we’re discussing bass with the 62-year-old Hall of Fame rocker. While the 4-string isn’t something typically associated with Morello, it’s been a part of his life since he first got serious about music at the age of 17. Not only does he write and perform it on his own material, but he confides in us, “I’ve played bass on a lot of records before, including some that you don’t know and I won’t name.”

One record he will name is his freshly minted solo album Everyone Gets Everything They Want, which marks his first solo rock album. Featuring Serj Tankian, Kneecap, and Beartooth, the album was co-written by his 15-year-old guitar whiz son, Roman Morello. And while the guitar riffs and shredding take the spotlight, beneath it all is the bass work of Tom who pulls double duty on all but three of the songs (where Roman and producer Zakk Cervini handle the low end). Reminiscent of his high-powered, riff-centered songwriting with Rage, the new album finds Morello reenergized and with more angst than ever about the current political climate and state of affairs. 

Fresh off of a summer tour with Bruce Springsteen and his successful Power to the People Music Festival, Morello sat down to discuss his bass playing for the first time ever, proving that the Harvard graduate rock legend knows a thing or two about 4-string.  

The “Killing in the Name” riff was actually written on bass. Would that have happened if it had been a guitar instead? I don’t think so. The bass will lead the way for me sometimes.

Fans might be surprised that you’re a bass player.

I’ve been a bass player and a guitar player since day one. The “Killing in the Name” riff was actually written on bass. I wrote that on my $75 Kramer bass. If you kick the distortion pedal on a bass the riffs start sounding like Rage Against the Machine. Similarly, if you kick on the octave pedal on the guitar you get also get Rage. I’m very comfortable playing and writing on bass and I love the instrument. I’m not trying to be Geddy Lee or Tim Commerford for that matter, but I feel confident that I can make a groove happen and a riff pop.

How do you approach bass, being a guitarist?

For me, the bass guitar just makes different suggestions than guitar does. When I sit down to be creative or jam with others or by myself, the instrument that you have and the tone that comes out of it — whether it’s a bass, a mandolin, or an acoustic guitar — it guides you in a way that steers your creativity in unexpected ways. A perfect example of that is the “Killing in the Name” riff. I was a guitar teacher in Hollywood in 1991 and I was giving a guitar lesson to a very accomplished local guitar player who played in bands that were contemporary to mine. I was showing him how to do drop D tuning. I was playing on a Kramer bass demonstrating how you drop it down and how it reconfigures the fretboard. The first riff that came out of my fingers was the big riff from “Killing in the Name.” Would that have happened if it had been a guitar instead? I don’t think so. The bass will lead the way for me sometimes.

Did you write any of the songs on this record with bass as the starting point?

Definitely, and it was another scenario where the idea came out of thin air. This record starts with “Beth From Electronics,” which came about when I was tracking bass for another song. While I was treading water and getting ready for the next track, I started playing that. It just came out. It was an improvised, one-take through thing that I was jamming. I finished and asked if they had recorded it. Luckily, they had and I told them we were going to start the record with it.

I’m not trying to be Geddy Lee or Tim Commerford for that matter, but I feel confident that I can make a groove happen and a riff pop.

How do you track and dial it in the burly bass tone you got on the record? 

With maybe one exception it was all amps. The one that I’ve been recording on that [producer] Brendan O’Brien told me to get years and years ago is a little Ampeg that just sounds fantastic. I don’t track through a monster bass rig because that’s not needed in the studio. I put a mic in front of it and it sounds so good. I use that or I plug it directly into my Marshall half stack. Maybe 65% of the bass was done that way on this record. Whenever I would be done with the guitar I would just plug right into it with my bass.

Are you pretty intentional about keeping the bass and guitar frequencies separate when doing that?

Actually, one of the things that’s really effective when I’m recording riffs is making sure you don’t know where the guitar ends and the bass begins, sonically. I just want a tonal monster coming down the middle that’s fuzzy on both ends, springy on the top, and angry on the bottom. Throughout my entire riff-writing career that’s what I’m attracted to. We don’t even touch the mic or change the dials, I just unplug the guitar and plug my bass right in and pan the guitars left and right, Jimmy Page style, and then I put the bass right up the middle.

Did you put effects, distortion, and gain on the bass after the fact on this?

Sometimes I might add a little low end when I record through the guitar head. Sometimes Tyler [Smyth] will get his hands on my recording and will send a mix back and it has monstrous low end on it. It sounds so good that I don’t ask him any questions about what he did.

What is your ideal bass tone?  

There are different ideal bass sounds for different kinds of music I enjoy. Off the top of my head, I love not just the sound, but the approach to bass of Roger Waters with Pink Floyd. There’s nothing else like that. On any music with any instrument or any composition, having a point of view that is not just out of the ordinary, but also that has a different artistic expression stands out. Timmy C too, he’s a very unique bass player. He comes from a place of wanting the loudest bass and the loudest amp that anyone has ever heard both live and in the studio, and that attitude comes through. I also love the bass playing on the Gang of Four records. It’s funky and it’s punk and it’s countering the music. And of course, the classic Black Sabbath, which I was just listening to in the car with my kids. Geezer Butler set the standard from day one.

Timmy C is a very unique bass player. He comes from a place of wanting the loudest bass and the loudest amp that anyone has ever heard both live and in the studio, and that attitude comes through.

What is it like having played with Timmy C as your bassist for most of your musical career?

You can’t say Timmy C’s name without saying Brad Wilk’s name. Together they’re a force. Brendan O’Brien has made a lot of records with a lot of bands and after a session one day he stopped and said, “This is the best rhythm section in rock and roll.” I don’t disagree. The chemistry is what matters when it comes to a band and chemistry is born, not learned. The way that we three musicians play together in Rage, Prophets of Rage, and Audioslave is so specific to our chemistry. And if the connection is good you never get in the way of it or overintellectualize it.

How would you describe your playing with Timmy C and Brad? 

My natural inclination is that I play ahead of the beat. I’m an excitable person and I just push ahead. When we were recording the first Rage record it wasn’t sounding right because the engineer noticed that I play ahead of the beat. He took my guitar and moved it back some milliseconds so that it would line up perfectly and it didn’t sound like Rage Against the Machine anymore. I play ahead of the beat and Brad plays behind the beat naturally. The first time we played together he was auditioning for my band Lock Up in the ’80s, and we always had an organic way of playing together in sync. Only later did I realize that it’s because I play ahead and he played behind. And what is Timmy C? He’s right on the beat. Every time. The music, which could feel rushed or could feel dragging, is anchored by his monster bass. And it’s his huge bass tone that gives our songs their power. For the bigger riffs I use single coil pickups like my Telecaster or my “Arm the Homeless” guitar, which allows the riffs to be springier and allows the riffs to be funkier. But what makes them heavy is that Timmy C’s bass sounds like three Black Sabbaths. He ties everything together.

Do you play bass with a pick or fingerstyle?

I always use a pick. I can play with my fingers like Flea, but I’m much more comfortable with a pick. What I love is for the riffs to be able to lock in together when I’m playing both guitar and bass. I use a pick on bass so that they completely lock.

Which basses did you use in the studio?

I always use my Fender Precision bass. I’ve got one good bass that I love and that’s the one that I play. It’s a relatively recent build, not a vintage bass or anything. When I started recording my own music in the studio, I was still playing my original Kramer and an Ibanez I have, but none of it sounds like the bass that I prefer on records.

Speaking of your original Kramer, when did you first pick up the bass?

I would pick up a bass in my college band. We had a rehearsal room and I would go sit and play bass. I was able to play that 4-string loud and I would do a lot of slap bass, and it was all for fun. I wasn’t training myself for a recording career as a bass player. I just leaned into it because the instrument sounds fantastic and it’s so enjoyable. I noticed right away that it gave me a different way to write music. And as a riff writer, I loved writing on the bass. It took my head into a different space.

Was this around when you and Adam Jones [Tool] were playing together as kids?

Yes. Adam’s bass was in my basement for a while and we would switch on and off of who was playing guitar and who was playing bass. We both love riffs and so we both appreciated bass as much as guitar.

How would you describe the role of bass in your music?

The role of bass in my music is riff supporting but mosh pit inducing. I’m not trying to show off as a bass player or throw in insane fills. I’m trying to push the guitar riffs, which are at the forefront, over the top. There’s a lot of music where the guitar riffs are great, but the songs don’t always have the bass supporting them. I’m unapologetic about the fact that I love the bass locking with the guitar riff. In the music I like best, that’s job one. There’s plenty of bands where the guitars are doing this and the bass is doing that, and that’s fantastic, but for the music that I make I want them locked.

There’s a lot of music where the guitar riffs are great, but the songs don’t always have the bass supporting them. I’m unapologetic about the fact that I love the bass locking with the guitar riff.

What inspired you to create this album?

This is the 22nd album of my career, between Rage, Prophets of Rage, Audioslave, my solo work, and a couple of Bruce Springsteen records, but really this is the first Tom Morello rock solo album. The idea was, in the same way as the first Rage Against the Machine record or Audioslave record, to have all of the rock power that I can muster in my soul with a point of view that I’ve been carrying with me since I was 17 years old. It’s a record both for people who have had enough and for people who are ready to get in the mosh pit.

What was the writing process like? 

In some ways this was one of the most challenging records I’ve made from a creative point of view. I know how to make a record with a rock band, I know how to make a folk record, I know how to make a collaborative record, but to make something that’s going to stand toe-to-toe with my best work, with me as the frontman and riffs in the lead wasn’t always that easy. Now one of the things that’s been very helpful in this is my new muse in my back pocket, which is a young man by the name of Roman Morello. He lives in my house and I’ve now been relegated to being the rhythm guitarist in my own band because of his shredding prowess. He featured on five of the songs on this record. Basically, I’ve been putting my ear to his bedroom door, poaching his best riffs. That’s been one of the building blocks for this album. I can honestly say I’ve never had more fun writing music. We’ve played the last three summers together.

As a dad, how cool is it to be working with your son, musically?

The two craziest things are when you’re in a band with your kid and he’s shredding circles around you. And second, when you’re used to it. Now he’s just a dude in my band. With the principal difference being that if we have any band disagreements I can just send him to his room. [Laughs]

That’s what I’ve always leaned into — bands with songs with a message, but the message doesn’t mean a thing without the mosh pit.

When did you first decide to embark on a solo career?

One of the interesting things is that when I go out into the world, people don’t necessarily know that this solo career that I began in coffee houses in 2002 has blossomed into playing in front of about a million people this summer. Every year we go out and rock the biggest festivals in the world — destroying them while having a ball doing it. I want that energy. What really helped is working with producers like Zakk Cervini, Tyler Smyth, and Carl Restivo, and finding ways to take those big riffs and big ideas and coalesce them into big songs.

Having been in huge bands, what’s it like stepping out on your own and putting out material on your own?

From 2001 onward, when I began my singer-songwriter career, I would be on tour with Audioslave playing arenas, and on nights off I would go to open mic nights and sing my acoustic songs. I have 25 years of experience as a frontman. But what this record encapsulates is over the course of the last six or so years I’ve been touring the world with my great backup band, The Freedom Fighter Orchestra, and embracing the totality of that career. It’s been me fronting a rock show that embraces the Rage Against the Machine that world desperately needs, the memory of Chris Cornell, which the world desperately feels. I’m playing crazy guitar solos, leading with the heaviest riffs, and bringing that power. I wanted to make a record that encapsulates all of that: From my most ferocious riffs-writing with Rage and Audioslave to the Springsteen Darkness of the Edge of Town kind of songwriting. As a litmus test, this is a record that I listen to a lot. Sometimes you make a record and then go out in the world and play it, but this one has been kicking my ass.

What is the live show going to be like for this album?

This is going to sound like a monstrous riff barrage of guitars. When I make music it’s with an intention, not as a jam. It’s to celebrate rock and roll and it’s to celebrate resistance. The way that we play these songs live with these musicians is in a very purposeful way. You can come because you like the crazy guitar solos, you can come because you like the fact that you’re seeing a 15-year-old kid who’s better than his dad, you can come for any of it, but we have a lot of experience in destroying audiences. From punk clubs in Berlin to playing festivals for 180,000 people.

What are the larger concepts you want people to take from this album after listening to it.

This album is for people who have had enough. And for people who have been waiting for a great riff-oriented rebellious rock record. This is the next one. Every time I step into the studio, every time I’m going to play a guitar solo, every time I’m going to step onstage, I never look backwards. I’m always aiming for it to be the best show, to be the best riff, to be best solo, where I have some breakthrough like I’ve never had before. These song are anti-racist songs, these songs are anti-fascist songs, but above all, these are kick ass rock and roll songs. That’s what I’ve always leaned into — bands with songs with a message, but the message doesn’t mean a thing without the mosh pit.